Fireside Chat Transcript 13 Jun 2k20

awesome and in many situations it would be better instead of having cattle cruisers for us to go back to having old-school whelp canes which
are shield hurricanes. So we are going to be taking the hurricane part of that and we are going to be transforming them into
Mosh Masters.
Unfortunately, I'm not sure everybody understands the Mosh Master reference. If you've ever been on an Asher fleet and he tells the Mosh Master story,
you'll love it, but if not, make sure to annoy him and ask him. So we're going to do that.
Mosh Masters are going to be a thing. So if you have hurricanes and all the good stuff for that already in F7C,
that is just going to fold naturally into the Mosh Master doctrine.
And then the other side of this is we are going to be bringing Mallet Fleet up there. We want to have
efficient doctrines that are trading well with our enemies.
And so we're going to be abusing Feroxes and shield hurricanes in two separate doctrines to fuck around.
That's the big shift. Cattle Cruisers out and Mosh Masters and Mallet Fleet are back in.
So on the move up, we're going to be bringing Ferox fleet bits up to F7C and get stuck in with that.
And Arendis, is there a thread that we can post now?
I already posted them on Chrome.
Okay, cool.
I have to unmute him too. There we go.
Yeah, no, that's already posted.
Okay, so that's the big subcap doctrine change.
There's something else here that's pretty interesting that we're going to do.
So, CZB periodically swings the Nerf sledgehammer and ruins entire classes of ships.
We've seen this happen a million times.
And right now, when it comes to Dreadnoughts, the ugly fact, if you don't like Revelations,
or the beautiful fact, if you do like Revelations, they're my favorite Dreads, so I'm biased, I like lasers,
is that T2 gunned Revs are far and away unquestionably superior to all other forms of Dreadnoughts in EVE currently.
The amount of damage that they do is just absolutely ridiculous.
Now, normally, telling guys, "Hey, if you have an Avatar pilot, we need you to change it into a T2 gunned Rev, we need to catch up, guys,"
it would be a long, slow process, and there wouldn't be that much uptake.
But, Jay had a really cool fucking idea, which is that there is a sale that is happening right now, this weekend,
on extractors and injectors.
They're like 15% off, and the price of Plex has crashed because people aren't using their Roarquals.
So, we have figured out that it's actually relatively inexpensive, if you have less than 80 million SP,
to extract a bunch of Dreads that you don't want to use, or the SP from that, and then you can get into a T2 gunned Rev surprisingly cheap and immediately.
So, Jay, could you explain this to everybody here?
Yeah, sure. So, this requires you to already have T2 Siege or whatever.
If you've got dedicated Dread characters, and you want to extract a couple million SP from them,
you're looking up at the- I'll just put the sheet in, Elysium, actually.
Yeah, please do.
There you go. So, there's the little sheet thing.
And so you can see, it's about 3.9 million SP required to get into a T2 gunned Revelation with Dread 4 and the gun specs to 3.
So, it's pretty cheap to do it with under 80 million SP.
Once you get over 80 million, it's kind of ineffective or inefficient.
We don't recommend that people do this if you have more than 80 million SP.
It's for the lesser SP characters, the dedicated Dread alts, it's pretty easy to swap them.
Yeah. If you don't want to extract, I included the injector price, so just buying injectors, about 720 million ISK per injector, roughly, at the minute.
So, it's about, you know, 7 point- it's under 10 billion ISK if you're under 80 million SP, you can get into a Revelation.
That's assuming you have gun supports to 4 already, which everyone should, and, you know, T2 Siege.
So then, you have those two, 10 billion ISK, you're in.
Other Dreads will still be used.
So, if you're, like, a Die Hard Morox or a Die Hard Phoenix or Naglfar character, then...
We're still going to be using other Dreads, so they can't cheese tank us.
But Revelations are vastly superior.
Any Dread is good, but Revelations are the best.
So, we will still have some non-Rev Die Hards, and that's fine, because essentially what's going to happen is that you will be shooting through the holes of the hostile Revs.
But we want to have a majority Rev force, and there will still be a need for dedicated Die Hard non-Rev pilots.
So, if you're like, "Fuck the Revelation, fuck lasers, I love my Dreadnought," you can stick with it.
However, if you don't particularly care which type of Dread Haul you are using, please go over to Rev.
And thanks again to Jay for making this very useful image of Koss.
The reason why the Revelation is so strong, right, is because the Revelation is the only Dread that has 8 tank slots.
So you have 8 low slots for your tank, you get a resist bonus on it, so the other resist bonus Dread is the Phoenix, which only gets 7 mid slots, and it's not as tanky.
So, the Naglfar and the Morox are the weakest of the two, because they're not got resist bonuses.
However, their long-range guns are arguably better than the Revelation's.
So, long-range Naglfars, like artillery Naglfars, or actually, railgun Moroxes are really, really good.
So if you really want to get into a Morox or something, make sure you have your extra Dread Gun refits with you in the staging systems.
Alrighty. Hold on a moment.
Yeah, you could kind of consider it like a Omega Fleet 2.0 if you really want to, like the non-Revelation gun Dreads.
Except we won't lose them all in that GP this time, hopefully.
Alright. So, another question. We still have some more things to go over here, but to answer the question that Luke just had, which is, "Are we having a Locust Fleet tomorrow?"
Yes, it's going to be a Cricket Fleet. We're going to be in period basis, and that's a useful segue into some of the things we're going to be talking about next.
But let's cover, are there any other further questions that people have regarding the Dreadnought swap, or the need for it?
Why we're doing it, how we're doing it.
We have never pushed any kind of injector or extractor-oriented doctrine shift before in this alliance.
This is the first time we're saying, "Hey, not only are we swapping doctrines, please train it."
It's the first time we've said, "This is what it would cost to do it at various skill point levels."
So we're hoping that if this works out, it'll allow us to be more agile about doctrine swaps when our enemies change things.
So this is a test case for that.
The T2 guns fits, the fitting doesn't change.
The Dread fits on the forums, they have T1 guns on them. However, everything works.
All you have to do is put T2 guns on, and all the fitting works and everything. That's the way they're designed.
Am I actually just change the fitting on the forums for the Revelation just to have T2 guns by default?
Yeah, please do. We don't want to mistake people into thinking that T1...
This is a weird thing to do, but CCV has made it weird by making the T2 gun Revelation so good compared to all the others that were doing this.
And we have also adjusted the SRP accordingly. We are incentivizing people to be doing T2 revs over T1 revs.
Yeah, all T2 gun. Dread SRP has been buffed up a little bit to reflect the prices of the T2 guns.
We've been doing a lot of SRP tweaks to make sure that everything is accurate and covering what's needed this last week.
Let me see. So we're going to talk about a period basis for a little bit. That's going to be the next big thing.
Any incentives to swap up? Well, I think that it's disincentivized to have a T1 rev because there's no reason why you couldn't have a T2 rev at this point.
To put it in perspective, a T2 gun Dread does about 70% of the damage of just having another Dread.
So it's like 1.7 Dreads you're bringing if you have T2 guns.
Yeah, it's pretty extreme.
Okay, let me see. Another question. Yeah, please don't train Phoenixes just because you expect a gun nerf because we have extractors and ejectors now.
So if we need to swap over to a different kind of ship, we can just do it using this system.
Anyway, regardless of the PYFA excitement of arguing about this, this is what we are doing with the Dreadnoughts, guys. This is the thing.
We've been working on this now for the last week or so, and this is the system. T2 revs are preferenced, are incentivized, are what we are doing.
But again, there's always going to be use for the other Dreadnoughts in those fights because they'll be shooting into the holes of the bad guys that are revs.
Okay, so moving on. I want to talk about period bases because one of the challenges that we have at a strategic level is the fact that in Delve there is NPC space.
And in the drone regions, there is no NPC space. And what does that mean?
That means that after CCB has nerfed mining to shit and has repeatedly fucked with supers, we told everybody to dock your supers and don't use them for ratting in any way.
But if you wanted to, you could go to the off Delve colonies and period bases and run around with supers and we would not really care.
We wouldn't be able to defend you or bail you out, but you could go do it if you wanted.
We have now looked at what Fraternity has been doing and the way that Fraternity is basically shitting out ISK as fast as they can.
And the fact that it is very hard to harass an organization because we've been trying to fuck with them, who is super ratting in an area where there is no NPC space.
And we were taking a look at the map in period bases and we're like, instead of just telling people that they could go there and do it, we should actually make it become a serious thing.
So we just had a meeting with corp leaders. We met with the Kremlin before the fireside chat, and we are going to be encouraging people who want to rat in supers again to get back to crabbing.
But we're going to be doing it in period bases, and we're not just telling you guys to do it and then doing nothing.
GSOL is going to be installing more citadels.
Most of the IHUBS are already upgraded with the necessary ratting upgrades. Those ones that are not ready will be upgraded when the ADMs are there.
And essentially what we're going to be doing with this way is it's going to turn the money hose back on if we do this right.
I do anticipate that mistakes will be made. People are going to lose their odd ratting supers. It's going to take time for us to get it up properly coordinated.
But it's better than letting these things gather dust or using them only for combat.
So yeah, that's going to be a thing. We are now not just having a period bases as a thing that you could go to, but we are going to make a push to have an organized presence down there, including standing fleets and corp level involvement to start shitting out ISK.
I want to see if people have questions about that.
If hostiles want to bring their supers to period bases, they are welcome to. Sorry, that's not a question. Yes, they are obviously welcome to.
Yeah, so we will probably question about the umbrella. Well, there isn't really an umbrella anymore. You can't really have an umbrella in period bases.
The way that it is safe down there is having either corp level defenses or a standing fleet, which is something we're going to do and just do it the old fashioned way.
It is so geographically isolated that already a bunch of people have been doing this already, just not at a full blown level where we talk about it on a fireside.
So what we'll probably end up having here as this gets going is a standing fleet both in Delve and a standing fleet in period bases.
And if you're interested in, and yeah, it's absolutely true. Like Ashila Salakhai says he wanted to do a period protection SIG and that was denied.
And it's absolutely true. We told people you could go there and be the off Delve colonies and that we weren't going to support anybody and that we weren't going to do anything.
And then we spent some time analyzing what our enemies were doing and we realized that we needed to give it a go.
And so you're absolutely right. Before we were saying, nope, we're not going to support you. We're good on a period basis at your own risk off Delve colonies, whatever.
And now we're like, actually on second thought, let's give it a try and see what happens. So that's what we're doing.
Okay. So speaking of period basis, there is a cricket fleet. That's what people have started calling subcap mining using traditional old mining barges to Hoover up goo.
So there is conveniently, just as we're telling everybody to start thinking about using supers and crabbing and period basis tomorrow, we will be down there using what is what people have been calling cricket fleet.
You guys have, if you've been flying on one of those, you know what it's up. You already know about that. Yeah.
So there will be a cricket fleet tomorrow down in period basis, along with all the other hilarity that's going on.
You've never done a cricket fleet before. It's basically you just mine in barges with porpoises and you can mine whatever we want down there.
Like there isn't like a, we do this moon, then we do this moon, then we do this moon, then we leave. It's find a moon that you want to mine and mine it.
So you can order the most expensive moon if you want. You can do the least profitable moon. You can mine anything you want and you can mine, you know, until it's gone.
That's the point. Okay. So another thing I want to point out about the period basis project is that expect there to be adaptation from both the hostiles and from us.
So like next week or maybe even over the course of maybe not next fireside, but maybe in the next few days, we'll say, oh, we fucked up this.
Oh, we fucked up that. Oh, something went wrong. Oh, we realized we needed to do X, Y, and Z.
Whenever we do something new at an alliance level, we get stuck in, we make mistakes, and then we adapt. So that's what's going to happen.
Do we have an idea for a staging system in period basis? Well, there's a Keepstar and Hicks, but this is not something that we're going to have a official coordinated stager.
We already met with the corporate leadership in the Kremlin and basically said, look, smoke them if you got them. We're going to get down there and see what we can work out.
I believe that pretty rapidly you guys will figure out what is the most efficient way to do that. I personally am terrible at PBE. I don't do it at all, and I don't understand it at all.
So, I don't want to try to mandate from the top down, this is what we're going to do when it comes to the PBE stuff, because you guys were the ones that figured out how to create the super umbrella in Dell in the first place, in the good old days.
Okay, so more questions. Who will we ask in the chain of command to have local refineries turned on in period basis?
I think we're just dropping a whole lot. Yeah, that's a GSOL thing. So you would contact GSOL.
Corporate leadership has already been informed to contact Tuzzy if they have needs for new structures to be online down there.
So we do have, we are expecting to put down new infrastructure to make this easier for everybody.
And, you know, the reason why we do this, again, bringing it back to the macro level strategic stuff, is in a game where we are always in essentially a zero-sum competition with the other blocks in NullSec,
if we're in a scenario where other blocks in NullSec are able to super rat with impunity, we need to try to do that ourselves in period basis, because if we just keep these things docked and shelved, we can use them in combat.
But if Fraternity is able to crab the night away, we're going to give it a try to.
Will there be death? Will it be difficult? Will it be confusing? Who knows? We're going to get stuck in and find out, because that's how we do things here.
And props to Donray for coming up with the Crooked Fleet as little baby locusts.
Alright, so.
And you guys can see also here is sort of the pathway.
We turn period basis into a region that we have mostly ignored into something that shits out money again.
We can then, when we need to change doctrines, post a little spreadsheet of the kind that Jay just made and linked to you before we started talking about period basis, and say, "Hey, it's going to cost less than 5 billion isk for us to have you in a 2-2 gunned rev tomorrow, if you're characters of the appropriate skill point level."
And now we have a place that we can have it shit out money again, such that we are no longer as constrained in terms of rapid swaps to doctrines or whenever CCD changes something.
And yeah, it's a region, especially in Onsicon and Fireside, people are going to come fuck with you.
It's not like Amist, it's not safety, and we don't want things to ever be completely safe.
There will be death, mistakes will be made, we will try to adapt from them and unfuck them.
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Alright.
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"How are we dealing with the mack fleets from Snuff, as sacks don't work as well it seems?"
We have a variety of things that we are going to be doing, but I'm not going to talk about that on Fireside.
Spelling out how we're going to be countering Snuff is going to be foolish to say on Fireside.
I appreciate that, it's a good question. And it's something that we have been looking into, absolutely, that's why it's a good question.
But I'm not going to tell you the answer on Fireside. Future plans, baby, future plans.
Yeah, sack-o-lages are awesome, we have no intentions of-- jackdaws have been going great, people love jackdaws, sack-o-lages are fucking baller.
If you guys have been flying for the last couple weeks, you've probably seen me on a bunch of fleets on one of my alts.
And it was just the cattle cruisers that were a sticking point, we needed the tactical flexibility of being able to shift into hurricanes.
And we also need the efficiency flexibility of being able to grind people with ferroxes, so that's why we're changing that.
[silence]
Sometimes people ask questions about future plans, it's a very common bingo square.
So sometimes people aren't just being jackasses, they're just bingo baiting, which is a perfectly respectable tradition, and I don't mind it at all.
[silence]
Can we get a period-basis audio channel instead of Southern Delve hooligans?
That is a very good question, Midori, we hadn't thought of that.
And see, this is why I love Firesides, is that people come up with ideas that we should absolutely do and haven't done.
Yeah, sure, I'll make a mumble channel for it. I'm also going to clean up mumble a bit, because there are some channels on mumble that are owned by corporations that have moved on.
So I'll clean up mumble a little bit as well.
I can't answer any questions about the Harbingers, I haven't thought about the Harbingers specifically. Sorry, dudes.
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Let me see some other questions here. So, covering the CSM election.
Well, we fucking kicked ass, boys! Boys and girls, congratulations, we got three out of three Imperium candidates on there. High fives all around.
I'm really delighted by it. We did see less voting this year than in the past, but based upon our analysis, one of the reasons why we're looking at this whole period-basis thing in general is that CCP nerfed work walls and supers to the point that a lot of people just unsubbed those dedicated accounts.
So there was, yeah, so it was a bit of a squeaker as a result, in terms of getting a nominate on there at the very end, but I'm happy with it, and next year we'll probably hearf a bunch more blurfs.
One of the challenges electorally, as always, because we always win, it can be difficult to get people into "no, seriously, dude, fucking get off your ass and vote," because there's an assumption that we'll just win.
So certainly next year we're going to play a little bit more hardball in terms of hearfing blurfs and possibly having a nominate go kiss some babies, or kiss some hands and shake some babies, depending.
But yeah, the CSM thing has been fantastic, and even the puppies that are on there look like a pretty good group.
Mike Azaria is just a legit good dude, and so he's a CSM in the Steve Rnukin vein. I imagine Torvald seems like he's a cool dude, so I think he'll get along with our guys too.
It's a good team, it's a pretty smooth system, and we fucking won. We got everything that we wanted, really, and our enemies didn't.
I was talking about this on Fleet the other day, but it was just really funny seeing how it went down, because the NC. guys basically…
There was a lot of weird fratricide going on where Blazing Bunny didn't get on, they didn't coordinate their votes accurately. Blazing Bunny was the guy from NC.
And also the wormholers fought amongst themselves, there was nobody on the wormholers. Loraseco missed out by only 30 votes or something.
So we did it right, we were disciplined, we used the exit polls, we voted en masse, everybody exercised their freedom of choice to vote exactly the way that the state asked them to, and you guys did it.
Thank you, because you can see from how fucked up NC and PL and the wormholers and these other situations were, where their candidates could have and should have gotten on, like Legacy should have gotten more people,
but because they did not go… they were unwilling to do what we do, which is to say "motherfuckers, here's the ballot and we need you to be disciplined,"
and because they weren't disciplined, they missed out on seats that they by all rights should have gotten. So high fives all around, guys.
Alright, let me see what else I got.
I need to check my notes, make sure I haven't dropped anything.
Fire sidewise.
Okay.
What do I think of the new ships? I want to see what it's like when the rubber hits the road. I have a slight anti-support addiction, it turns out, and so obviously I'm very interested in the Vorton projectors,
because I hunger for the destruction of all interceptors I see on the field. Not that I'm obsessed or anything.
So yeah, I'm very, very, very curious about them and eager to see what we can make of them.
Is there a meta show today? Yes, and I should probably shut up on the fire side and go do that, but we have… today's a big pivot, guys.
Like, we have… we're changing our dreadnoughts, we're changing our battlecruiser line doctrine, like, we weren't using cattlecruisers that much because people didn't really like them that much,
we had to keep swapping them to… downshifting them to jackdaws, but we're going to use the fuck out of hurricanes and ferroxes.
If you've been in this alliance for a long time, you know that the whelp cane is basically like the AK-47 of goonswarm, and it's back, baby.
It's now a moshmaster, but it's a fucking whelp cane.
So.
Looking for some other… ah, yeah, meta show. Bingo. Congratulations, congratulations. Excellent bingo bait.
So yeah, like, you know, sometimes I come here on the fireside and it's like, not too much is going on.
This is a big alliance pivot kind of thing. Like, period basis is a thing, and when I say big alliance pivot, that includes, you know, all the usual ratting rights apply to all of our allies that are, you know, as part of the delve thing that applies to period basis too.
Water is warm, come on in. We want the Imperium to be rich because that money translates into skill goo, which translates into big nasty ships, which result in dead puppies, and fun for us.
Any other new sigs besides Jeff? No, at the moment, we're not announcing any new sigs or squads.
Jeff, you know, guys, by now you kind of figured it out, even if our enemies haven't figured it out.
Like, the last Jeff deployment we did was the first test of Jeff, and it was very much a, like, skirmish ban, let's do some training and stuff like this.
You guys probably have figured out that this is not a normal, like, just sigs and squads kind of thing.
Like, the entire command and control of the alliance is involved in this purge, and it involves a lot more than just snuffed.
And so if you are not in Jeff and you're not involved, like, we're, you know, maybe if I whisper it, you know, we're at war.
We're not necessarily telling the rest of Eve that we're at war, but we're kind of at war, and as long as they are not cluing in, we're gonna keep fucking murdering people until they fucking notice.
And if they don't notice until they're all dead, I'm fine with it.
But it's a Jeff deployment, so please join Jeff.
Oh, quick update as well.
Basically done, I'm done with the whole cleansing of the structures.
Obviously if you find a structure that's abandoned, then please message me on Jabba, and we'll get to clearing it.
But it took us, like, two days to do them all, and the loot from that will stop being...
I think we're gonna stop putting them on the market, I think, today or tomorrow. So yeah.
Alright, sweet.
Yeah, okay, so we've got a lot of work to do. There's the rev thing, there's the period basis thing, there is a move-op that's about to happen as soon as I shut up,
and we're gonna need people to bring Mallet Fleet, which is of course our Ferox Doctrine, up to F7C,
and we are going to need to stock the market in F7C and get contracts imported and all that other good stuff
to get Moshmasters, which are our whelp canes, and Mallet Fleet up and ready in F7C so we can grind grind grind.
So, Celine Hope has a really good question, thank you, which is, "Are we only moving super routing to period basis, or will other PVE be viable down there?"
You can do whatever the fuck you want PVE-wise and period basis. The whole idea here is for our people to get rich
such that we can stay richer than the puppies and keep killing them until the point that they are all poor and starving and helpless.
So, you can do whatever the fuck you want down in period basis, dude. It's there for you to exploit for income.
Brokaw should stay in parallel if I'm gonna keep her.
Yeah.
There's nuanced questions about ratting rules and priorities and stuff, and I am not equipped to answer those because I don't go into the weeds of PVE.
If there are conflicts about those, we will update those. Actually, that's a good point, because we...
Lars Grey, I don't know what the conflict is, but if you say something, we will...
Can allied alliances... I think I answered this earlier, Adanska, but allies are absolutely welcome.
Allies are welcome in Delve. The same rules that we have in Delve apply in period basis.
We're all in this thing together, and we all need to be rich such that we can make more spaceships with which to murder the bad guys.
Okay. I gotta get ready for the meta show, and we also need to have me shut up because there's a fucking move-up on, and we've got stuff to do because we are kinda at war,
and, you know, again, sort of like whispers and quiet and stuff, but like, join the Jeff. Please, join Jeff. We're doing things.
It's just Six and Squad, guys, but actually we're at war, and we're gonna stay at war for as long as we can until there's nothing left for us to fucking murder up there.
Okay, so that's it. Get going, guys. We're doing it.
I will go to the meta show, and there's gonna be move-up pings coming shortly. Thank you all for coming, and let's get stuck in.
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